Is nibbana eternal?Enlightenment vs nibbana/nirvanaIs Nirvana eternal?How is Nibbana unconditioned?Where is...
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Is nibbana eternal?
Enlightenment vs nibbana/nirvanaIs Nirvana eternal?How is Nibbana unconditioned?Where is Nibbana/Nirvana being Unconditioned stated in the Canon?Is it possible to describe nibbana?What are the conditions necessary for Nibbana?Does Nibbana mean not self?Does any real existent or genuine person end with parinibbana?How can we conclude that something is unarisen and eternal?Does Nibbana lie within The All or not?
Arising dhamma is ceasing dhamma so much as ceasing dhamma is arising dhamma as well.
What does this mean? The answer should be nibbana is not eternal either.
I'm asking about the Pali in this quote from SN 56.11:
And while this discourse was being spoken, the stainless, immaculate vision of the Dhamma arose in Venerable Koṇḍañña:
Imasmiñca pana veyyākaraṇasmiṃ bhaññamāne āyasmato koṇḍaññassa virajaṃ vītamalaṃ dhammacakkhuṃ udapādi:
“Everything that has a beginning has an end.”
“yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamman”ti.
nirvana
add a comment |
Arising dhamma is ceasing dhamma so much as ceasing dhamma is arising dhamma as well.
What does this mean? The answer should be nibbana is not eternal either.
I'm asking about the Pali in this quote from SN 56.11:
And while this discourse was being spoken, the stainless, immaculate vision of the Dhamma arose in Venerable Koṇḍañña:
Imasmiñca pana veyyākaraṇasmiṃ bhaññamāne āyasmato koṇḍaññassa virajaṃ vītamalaṃ dhammacakkhuṃ udapādi:
“Everything that has a beginning has an end.”
“yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamman”ti.
nirvana
Is the first sentence ("Arising dhamma is ceasing") a quote? Where is it from, what is that quoting?
– ChrisW♦
5 hours ago
Imasmiñca pana veyyākaraṇasmiṃ bhaññamāne āyasmato koṇḍaññassa virajaṃ vītamalaṃ dhammacakkhuṃ udapādi – ‘‘ yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ, sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamma ’’ nti
– X-pression
4 hours ago
Thank you for explaining. I added that quote to the question (together with Ven. Sujato's translation of it).
– ChrisW♦
4 hours ago
Thank you Chris. What I would like to say is as simple as we don't hope the world be with complete cessation of suffering. That would make another sort of craving in this world.
– X-pression
4 hours ago
Standard question. Below there are three standard correct answers therefore it is not necessary for me to repeat. Only conditioned things (sankhara) are impermanent. The uncondiitioned (visankhara) is permanent.
– Dhammadhatu
18 mins ago
add a comment |
Arising dhamma is ceasing dhamma so much as ceasing dhamma is arising dhamma as well.
What does this mean? The answer should be nibbana is not eternal either.
I'm asking about the Pali in this quote from SN 56.11:
And while this discourse was being spoken, the stainless, immaculate vision of the Dhamma arose in Venerable Koṇḍañña:
Imasmiñca pana veyyākaraṇasmiṃ bhaññamāne āyasmato koṇḍaññassa virajaṃ vītamalaṃ dhammacakkhuṃ udapādi:
“Everything that has a beginning has an end.”
“yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamman”ti.
nirvana
Arising dhamma is ceasing dhamma so much as ceasing dhamma is arising dhamma as well.
What does this mean? The answer should be nibbana is not eternal either.
I'm asking about the Pali in this quote from SN 56.11:
And while this discourse was being spoken, the stainless, immaculate vision of the Dhamma arose in Venerable Koṇḍañña:
Imasmiñca pana veyyākaraṇasmiṃ bhaññamāne āyasmato koṇḍaññassa virajaṃ vītamalaṃ dhammacakkhuṃ udapādi:
“Everything that has a beginning has an end.”
“yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamman”ti.
nirvana
nirvana
edited 4 hours ago
ChrisW♦
29.9k42485
29.9k42485
asked 5 hours ago
X-pressionX-pression
455
455
Is the first sentence ("Arising dhamma is ceasing") a quote? Where is it from, what is that quoting?
– ChrisW♦
5 hours ago
Imasmiñca pana veyyākaraṇasmiṃ bhaññamāne āyasmato koṇḍaññassa virajaṃ vītamalaṃ dhammacakkhuṃ udapādi – ‘‘ yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ, sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamma ’’ nti
– X-pression
4 hours ago
Thank you for explaining. I added that quote to the question (together with Ven. Sujato's translation of it).
– ChrisW♦
4 hours ago
Thank you Chris. What I would like to say is as simple as we don't hope the world be with complete cessation of suffering. That would make another sort of craving in this world.
– X-pression
4 hours ago
Standard question. Below there are three standard correct answers therefore it is not necessary for me to repeat. Only conditioned things (sankhara) are impermanent. The uncondiitioned (visankhara) is permanent.
– Dhammadhatu
18 mins ago
add a comment |
Is the first sentence ("Arising dhamma is ceasing") a quote? Where is it from, what is that quoting?
– ChrisW♦
5 hours ago
Imasmiñca pana veyyākaraṇasmiṃ bhaññamāne āyasmato koṇḍaññassa virajaṃ vītamalaṃ dhammacakkhuṃ udapādi – ‘‘ yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ, sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamma ’’ nti
– X-pression
4 hours ago
Thank you for explaining. I added that quote to the question (together with Ven. Sujato's translation of it).
– ChrisW♦
4 hours ago
Thank you Chris. What I would like to say is as simple as we don't hope the world be with complete cessation of suffering. That would make another sort of craving in this world.
– X-pression
4 hours ago
Standard question. Below there are three standard correct answers therefore it is not necessary for me to repeat. Only conditioned things (sankhara) are impermanent. The uncondiitioned (visankhara) is permanent.
– Dhammadhatu
18 mins ago
Is the first sentence ("Arising dhamma is ceasing") a quote? Where is it from, what is that quoting?
– ChrisW♦
5 hours ago
Is the first sentence ("Arising dhamma is ceasing") a quote? Where is it from, what is that quoting?
– ChrisW♦
5 hours ago
Imasmiñca pana veyyākaraṇasmiṃ bhaññamāne āyasmato koṇḍaññassa virajaṃ vītamalaṃ dhammacakkhuṃ udapādi – ‘‘ yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ, sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamma ’’ nti
– X-pression
4 hours ago
Imasmiñca pana veyyākaraṇasmiṃ bhaññamāne āyasmato koṇḍaññassa virajaṃ vītamalaṃ dhammacakkhuṃ udapādi – ‘‘ yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ, sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamma ’’ nti
– X-pression
4 hours ago
Thank you for explaining. I added that quote to the question (together with Ven. Sujato's translation of it).
– ChrisW♦
4 hours ago
Thank you for explaining. I added that quote to the question (together with Ven. Sujato's translation of it).
– ChrisW♦
4 hours ago
Thank you Chris. What I would like to say is as simple as we don't hope the world be with complete cessation of suffering. That would make another sort of craving in this world.
– X-pression
4 hours ago
Thank you Chris. What I would like to say is as simple as we don't hope the world be with complete cessation of suffering. That would make another sort of craving in this world.
– X-pression
4 hours ago
Standard question. Below there are three standard correct answers therefore it is not necessary for me to repeat. Only conditioned things (sankhara) are impermanent. The uncondiitioned (visankhara) is permanent.
– Dhammadhatu
18 mins ago
Standard question. Below there are three standard correct answers therefore it is not necessary for me to repeat. Only conditioned things (sankhara) are impermanent. The uncondiitioned (visankhara) is permanent.
– Dhammadhatu
18 mins ago
add a comment |
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
"Everything that has a beginning has an end.” means every-thing, every conditioned, manifested thing is impermanent. Nibbana is not conditioned and it is not manifested state, so it does not have a beginning or end
My English is not good so I looked to the meaning of eternal. It says that: "lasting or existing forever; without end"
If you try to describe Nibbana with using "time" then it won't lead you to the right direction because Nibbana is the unconditioned. It is timeless. You can use that term, If you mean being "deathless" by saying eternal. Nibbana is free from any conditioned state. It is free from birth, death, time. It is the unmanifested state.
Thich Nhat Hanh wonderfully talks about Nibbana: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odWIPhj-ivo
add a comment |
The pali is the usual “yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamman”ti, which is the usual, badly said: whatever will samudaya will nirodha. so it is the usual whatever is subject to arising will cease too.
And nibanna does not arise and does not cease, that's the whole point of nibanna.
Before whatever arises it is nibbana. After whatever ceases it is nibbana. After whatever arises it is not nibbana as much as before whatever ceases it is not nibbana either. Therefore nibbana is not eternal.
– X-pression
3 hours ago
The above comment is incomprehensible.
– Dhammadhatu
15 mins ago
add a comment |
What we usually understand as happiness is dependent on specific condition, which need to be controlled, arranged, fulfilled and satisfied in order to reach that specific and temporary state.
The happiness of Nibbana is what remains after removing the desire for control and satisfaction of the senses and the ego. If you eliminate the conditions for suffering, what remains is peace without conditions. Thus, you don't need anything in special to feel satisfied, because craving, aversion and ignorance have been eradicated. You feel content because you took off what blocked that peace of simplicity and renunciation.
That's why it's called "The Unconditioned".
As long as the conditions (craving, aversion and delusion) are uprooted, Nibbana should be eternal. If those conditions are still there in the mind, then, at most, you can have "glimpses" of Nibbana.
Also, remember that:
"Sabbe sankhara anicca": everything conditioned is impermanent.
"Sabbe sankhara dukkha": everything conditioned is unsatisfactory.
"Sabbe dhamma anatta": all dhammas are not-self
The word "Dhamma" can be used to talk about the Buddha's teachings, as well to refer to any phenomena. It all depends on the context. And I think the quote you posted is talking about conditioned dhammas, i.e. sankharas.
Kind regards!
add a comment |
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3 Answers
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3 Answers
3
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votes
"Everything that has a beginning has an end.” means every-thing, every conditioned, manifested thing is impermanent. Nibbana is not conditioned and it is not manifested state, so it does not have a beginning or end
My English is not good so I looked to the meaning of eternal. It says that: "lasting or existing forever; without end"
If you try to describe Nibbana with using "time" then it won't lead you to the right direction because Nibbana is the unconditioned. It is timeless. You can use that term, If you mean being "deathless" by saying eternal. Nibbana is free from any conditioned state. It is free from birth, death, time. It is the unmanifested state.
Thich Nhat Hanh wonderfully talks about Nibbana: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odWIPhj-ivo
add a comment |
"Everything that has a beginning has an end.” means every-thing, every conditioned, manifested thing is impermanent. Nibbana is not conditioned and it is not manifested state, so it does not have a beginning or end
My English is not good so I looked to the meaning of eternal. It says that: "lasting or existing forever; without end"
If you try to describe Nibbana with using "time" then it won't lead you to the right direction because Nibbana is the unconditioned. It is timeless. You can use that term, If you mean being "deathless" by saying eternal. Nibbana is free from any conditioned state. It is free from birth, death, time. It is the unmanifested state.
Thich Nhat Hanh wonderfully talks about Nibbana: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odWIPhj-ivo
add a comment |
"Everything that has a beginning has an end.” means every-thing, every conditioned, manifested thing is impermanent. Nibbana is not conditioned and it is not manifested state, so it does not have a beginning or end
My English is not good so I looked to the meaning of eternal. It says that: "lasting or existing forever; without end"
If you try to describe Nibbana with using "time" then it won't lead you to the right direction because Nibbana is the unconditioned. It is timeless. You can use that term, If you mean being "deathless" by saying eternal. Nibbana is free from any conditioned state. It is free from birth, death, time. It is the unmanifested state.
Thich Nhat Hanh wonderfully talks about Nibbana: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odWIPhj-ivo
"Everything that has a beginning has an end.” means every-thing, every conditioned, manifested thing is impermanent. Nibbana is not conditioned and it is not manifested state, so it does not have a beginning or end
My English is not good so I looked to the meaning of eternal. It says that: "lasting or existing forever; without end"
If you try to describe Nibbana with using "time" then it won't lead you to the right direction because Nibbana is the unconditioned. It is timeless. You can use that term, If you mean being "deathless" by saying eternal. Nibbana is free from any conditioned state. It is free from birth, death, time. It is the unmanifested state.
Thich Nhat Hanh wonderfully talks about Nibbana: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odWIPhj-ivo
edited 4 hours ago
answered 4 hours ago
Murathan1Murathan1
34925
34925
add a comment |
add a comment |
The pali is the usual “yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamman”ti, which is the usual, badly said: whatever will samudaya will nirodha. so it is the usual whatever is subject to arising will cease too.
And nibanna does not arise and does not cease, that's the whole point of nibanna.
Before whatever arises it is nibbana. After whatever ceases it is nibbana. After whatever arises it is not nibbana as much as before whatever ceases it is not nibbana either. Therefore nibbana is not eternal.
– X-pression
3 hours ago
The above comment is incomprehensible.
– Dhammadhatu
15 mins ago
add a comment |
The pali is the usual “yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamman”ti, which is the usual, badly said: whatever will samudaya will nirodha. so it is the usual whatever is subject to arising will cease too.
And nibanna does not arise and does not cease, that's the whole point of nibanna.
Before whatever arises it is nibbana. After whatever ceases it is nibbana. After whatever arises it is not nibbana as much as before whatever ceases it is not nibbana either. Therefore nibbana is not eternal.
– X-pression
3 hours ago
The above comment is incomprehensible.
– Dhammadhatu
15 mins ago
add a comment |
The pali is the usual “yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamman”ti, which is the usual, badly said: whatever will samudaya will nirodha. so it is the usual whatever is subject to arising will cease too.
And nibanna does not arise and does not cease, that's the whole point of nibanna.
The pali is the usual “yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamman”ti, which is the usual, badly said: whatever will samudaya will nirodha. so it is the usual whatever is subject to arising will cease too.
And nibanna does not arise and does not cease, that's the whole point of nibanna.
answered 3 hours ago
user12901user12901
2231
2231
Before whatever arises it is nibbana. After whatever ceases it is nibbana. After whatever arises it is not nibbana as much as before whatever ceases it is not nibbana either. Therefore nibbana is not eternal.
– X-pression
3 hours ago
The above comment is incomprehensible.
– Dhammadhatu
15 mins ago
add a comment |
Before whatever arises it is nibbana. After whatever ceases it is nibbana. After whatever arises it is not nibbana as much as before whatever ceases it is not nibbana either. Therefore nibbana is not eternal.
– X-pression
3 hours ago
The above comment is incomprehensible.
– Dhammadhatu
15 mins ago
Before whatever arises it is nibbana. After whatever ceases it is nibbana. After whatever arises it is not nibbana as much as before whatever ceases it is not nibbana either. Therefore nibbana is not eternal.
– X-pression
3 hours ago
Before whatever arises it is nibbana. After whatever ceases it is nibbana. After whatever arises it is not nibbana as much as before whatever ceases it is not nibbana either. Therefore nibbana is not eternal.
– X-pression
3 hours ago
The above comment is incomprehensible.
– Dhammadhatu
15 mins ago
The above comment is incomprehensible.
– Dhammadhatu
15 mins ago
add a comment |
What we usually understand as happiness is dependent on specific condition, which need to be controlled, arranged, fulfilled and satisfied in order to reach that specific and temporary state.
The happiness of Nibbana is what remains after removing the desire for control and satisfaction of the senses and the ego. If you eliminate the conditions for suffering, what remains is peace without conditions. Thus, you don't need anything in special to feel satisfied, because craving, aversion and ignorance have been eradicated. You feel content because you took off what blocked that peace of simplicity and renunciation.
That's why it's called "The Unconditioned".
As long as the conditions (craving, aversion and delusion) are uprooted, Nibbana should be eternal. If those conditions are still there in the mind, then, at most, you can have "glimpses" of Nibbana.
Also, remember that:
"Sabbe sankhara anicca": everything conditioned is impermanent.
"Sabbe sankhara dukkha": everything conditioned is unsatisfactory.
"Sabbe dhamma anatta": all dhammas are not-self
The word "Dhamma" can be used to talk about the Buddha's teachings, as well to refer to any phenomena. It all depends on the context. And I think the quote you posted is talking about conditioned dhammas, i.e. sankharas.
Kind regards!
add a comment |
What we usually understand as happiness is dependent on specific condition, which need to be controlled, arranged, fulfilled and satisfied in order to reach that specific and temporary state.
The happiness of Nibbana is what remains after removing the desire for control and satisfaction of the senses and the ego. If you eliminate the conditions for suffering, what remains is peace without conditions. Thus, you don't need anything in special to feel satisfied, because craving, aversion and ignorance have been eradicated. You feel content because you took off what blocked that peace of simplicity and renunciation.
That's why it's called "The Unconditioned".
As long as the conditions (craving, aversion and delusion) are uprooted, Nibbana should be eternal. If those conditions are still there in the mind, then, at most, you can have "glimpses" of Nibbana.
Also, remember that:
"Sabbe sankhara anicca": everything conditioned is impermanent.
"Sabbe sankhara dukkha": everything conditioned is unsatisfactory.
"Sabbe dhamma anatta": all dhammas are not-self
The word "Dhamma" can be used to talk about the Buddha's teachings, as well to refer to any phenomena. It all depends on the context. And I think the quote you posted is talking about conditioned dhammas, i.e. sankharas.
Kind regards!
add a comment |
What we usually understand as happiness is dependent on specific condition, which need to be controlled, arranged, fulfilled and satisfied in order to reach that specific and temporary state.
The happiness of Nibbana is what remains after removing the desire for control and satisfaction of the senses and the ego. If you eliminate the conditions for suffering, what remains is peace without conditions. Thus, you don't need anything in special to feel satisfied, because craving, aversion and ignorance have been eradicated. You feel content because you took off what blocked that peace of simplicity and renunciation.
That's why it's called "The Unconditioned".
As long as the conditions (craving, aversion and delusion) are uprooted, Nibbana should be eternal. If those conditions are still there in the mind, then, at most, you can have "glimpses" of Nibbana.
Also, remember that:
"Sabbe sankhara anicca": everything conditioned is impermanent.
"Sabbe sankhara dukkha": everything conditioned is unsatisfactory.
"Sabbe dhamma anatta": all dhammas are not-self
The word "Dhamma" can be used to talk about the Buddha's teachings, as well to refer to any phenomena. It all depends on the context. And I think the quote you posted is talking about conditioned dhammas, i.e. sankharas.
Kind regards!
What we usually understand as happiness is dependent on specific condition, which need to be controlled, arranged, fulfilled and satisfied in order to reach that specific and temporary state.
The happiness of Nibbana is what remains after removing the desire for control and satisfaction of the senses and the ego. If you eliminate the conditions for suffering, what remains is peace without conditions. Thus, you don't need anything in special to feel satisfied, because craving, aversion and ignorance have been eradicated. You feel content because you took off what blocked that peace of simplicity and renunciation.
That's why it's called "The Unconditioned".
As long as the conditions (craving, aversion and delusion) are uprooted, Nibbana should be eternal. If those conditions are still there in the mind, then, at most, you can have "glimpses" of Nibbana.
Also, remember that:
"Sabbe sankhara anicca": everything conditioned is impermanent.
"Sabbe sankhara dukkha": everything conditioned is unsatisfactory.
"Sabbe dhamma anatta": all dhammas are not-self
The word "Dhamma" can be used to talk about the Buddha's teachings, as well to refer to any phenomena. It all depends on the context. And I think the quote you posted is talking about conditioned dhammas, i.e. sankharas.
Kind regards!
edited 1 hour ago
answered 1 hour ago
Brian Díaz FloresBrian Díaz Flores
37318
37318
add a comment |
add a comment |
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Is the first sentence ("Arising dhamma is ceasing") a quote? Where is it from, what is that quoting?
– ChrisW♦
5 hours ago
Imasmiñca pana veyyākaraṇasmiṃ bhaññamāne āyasmato koṇḍaññassa virajaṃ vītamalaṃ dhammacakkhuṃ udapādi – ‘‘ yaṃ kiñci samudayadhammaṃ, sabbaṃ taṃ nirodhadhamma ’’ nti
– X-pression
4 hours ago
Thank you for explaining. I added that quote to the question (together with Ven. Sujato's translation of it).
– ChrisW♦
4 hours ago
Thank you Chris. What I would like to say is as simple as we don't hope the world be with complete cessation of suffering. That would make another sort of craving in this world.
– X-pression
4 hours ago
Standard question. Below there are three standard correct answers therefore it is not necessary for me to repeat. Only conditioned things (sankhara) are impermanent. The uncondiitioned (visankhara) is permanent.
– Dhammadhatu
18 mins ago